First Rolls

[yo1dog]

Lots of lessons learned so far. About 1 hour of effort. Was going for about Churchill size. Featured is the best stick of the lot.

I ordered my leaves from WLT. They arrived in nice vacuum sealed bags and I noticed the filler was driest and wrapper was wettest. I assumed this meant the leaves came properly cased. Not so. I noticed after rolling a few the filler was crumbling everywhere. More so than I'd seen in videos. Also I had a hard time with the binder cracking apart.

The fat sicks in the left of the picture are not rolled tightly enough. The dry leaves prevented me from being able to roll tight without everything cracking apart. The sticks on the right side is when I started misting the leaves before rolling. Made a huge difference.

I learned I should use the outer part of the wrapper leaves to avoid the thick viens near the stem. The Ecuador Maduro Wrapper leaves that came with the kit seems to have very thick veins. Interestingly, in my naive opinion it seemed like the Sumatra Binder leaves from the kit were better suited for wrapping. Sumatra is near perfect leaves with light veins while the Ecuador is all bunched up with very thick veins.

I also didn't pay attention to what side of the leaf was facing outward.

Question: Do you have to cap/flag the head of the cigars?

 

[ChinaVoodoo]

Good summary of the experience.

I always judge the moisture level of the leaves separately. I have a dedicated spray bottle to bring the hydration up to good rolling levels. It doesn't take much or long.

The Sumatra binder is probably similar to the old besuki wrapper I have. It seems that the indonesian spend a lot of time flattening their leaves before sending them overseas. I got attached to this early on in my rolling, but I have since learned that it just takes patience to rehydrate pretty much all the other wrappers. I spritz them at least a day before using them. This helps the veins to soften up.

 

[GreenDragon]

You are off to a good start! Remember, the pro's roll several hundred a day for a year before being considered proficient. You will get better with every one you roll.
The leaf is shipped in proper case for the area that it was packed in. Here in the Austin area I always have to increase the case of all my leaf to roll properly.
No, caps are not necessary, and I don't put them on if the cigar is just for myself. They are really there to make the cigar look nice and to let the smoker know which end is which.

 

[Mathaious12]

Congrats on your first sticks! If you leave the filler leaves out and uncovered/unsealed they can dry out depending on the humidity where you are. Don takes pride in shipping at proper case levels, so I'm assuming this is the issue. Try use plastic grocery bags to preserve the case while you roll if you didn't. Also only pull out what your going to use in that session, and folding the bag to creat a seal while not grabbing leaf. This save bulk of the leaves from drying out and preserves the casing on the leaves your working with.

 

[GreenDragon]

I have since learned that it just takes patience to rehydrate pretty much all the other wrappers. I spritz them at least a day before using them. This helps the veins to soften up.

What China said.
I usually take out a quantity of each leaf before a rolling session, and transfer them to separate 2 gallon ziplok bags, spritz water to bring to proper case, and let them sit for a few hours to overnight before rolling. Then right before rolling I check them again and adjust case as necessary. Don't try to bring a whole bag of leaf to working case - it will mold on you if you don't use it all.

 

[Charly]

Nice first sticks !
It takes a little bit of practice to know the right case for filler / binder / wrapper leaves.
You are on the right way, just continue. And don't forget to test the draw (before and after applying the wrapper), it's easy to unroll and adapt at this stage (before the cigar dries to smoking conditions).

 

[Nathan Esq]

Nice sticks and review. I'm fairly new and only cap, sometimes. Usually I just twist a pigtail. I started rolling with paper and it was tough getting a tight roll with dry leaf. Rolling with wet filler takes a long time to dry. I've since started using a mold and clamps with good success after my first disaster. My bunches are still inconsistent. Binding with
Sumatra takes some practice, but is better doubled up for me, and it does make a nice cheap wrapper. I've found it very difficult keeping everything at proper case. Some viso is thicker than some Ligero, etc, etc. As the weather changes so does the case if my leaf, it goes up and down in case.With all that said, I've only had 2-3 unsmokable cigars out of about 150-200. Hope this helped.

 

[jclif43]

You’re right about the veins being thinner toward outer edge of the wrapper. If you watch any of the rolling videos that are available, you will notice the roller will trim both outer and inner edges. The trim on the stem side helps remove that area where the veins are the largest. You only need wrapper leaf to be 2 or 3 inches wide. As others have said though, it isn’t necessary, it’s mainly an esthetics issue. It doesn’t have to be pretty to taste good. I‘m still a newb myself, so lots of trial an error. Happy rolling.

 

[Jim D]

Nice looking first rolls! I'm aligned with the advice provided above, practice and patience will get you the results you are looking for. Some of us use the inner strip of the wrapper as a binder since it has more pronounced veins.
If I have a stick I plan to smoke at 4:30am on the way to work, I'll use any section of the wrapper as no one will ever see it (including myself in the dark).
Happy rolling!

 

[DePasta]

Yep....being a cheap bastard I use the whole leaf, usually get 2 wrappers a side out of the larger leafed varieties.....

 

[yo1dog]

Wow! Thanks for the great (and quick!) feedback guys. I've only been browsing the forums for a few days but this seems to be a very active and friendly community.

The leaf is shipped in proper case for the area that it was packed in. Here in the Austin area I always have to increase the case of all my leaf to roll properly.

If you leave the filler leaves out and uncovered/unsealed they can dry out depending on the humidity where you are. Don takes pride in shipping at proper case levels, so I'm assuming this is the issue.

Ah that makes sense. I'll amend my previous statement from "the leaves did not arrive cased" to "the leaves did not arrive cased for my location". In Ohio it's been 37-63°F. Here in Austin it's been 52-79°F. That increase in temperature means a decrease in relative humidity which explains why my leaves were on the dry side.

I did let the leaves sit out while I rolled, but that was around 1 hour. I wouldn't think they would dry out that quickly.

I will continue to experiment with the casing and I'll let y'all know how my next roll session goes. I've already learned a ton since my first.

In the mean time, I grabbed the worst, ugliest, dog turd-iest looking stick from my first batch. It was an enjoyable smoke. Despite it being way too loose, uneven, and unraveling since I accidentally smoked it from the wrong end. Burned a little hot since it was so loosely packed, but smoking it slow fixed that. Plus my wife still thought I was a cool guy for rolling my own.

Falling fall short of perfection is not wasted effort. Cheers.

 

[yo1dog]

Just found this bit of text from the wiki:

Tobacco Problems Wiki

wholeleaftobacco.com

2. Moisture Control

Whole leaf shipped by WLT usually comes in sealed bags. Their poly-nylon bags are entirely vapor-proof, and their heavy gauge polyethylene bags are nearly so. It is sealed within the bags at medium case (fully pliable, but not damp) at controlled, warehouse temperature—like a typical home. If the sealed bag is shipped or stored at a significantly lower temperature, the internal relative humidity will increase.

As I stated before, the opposite is also true; If the sealed bag is shipped or stored at a significantly higher temperature, the internal relative humidity will decrease.

 

[Jim D]

.....

I did let the leaves sit out while I rolled, but that was around 1 hour. I wouldn't think they would dry out that quickly.

I will continue to experiment with the casing and I'll let y'all know how my next roll session goes. I've already learned a ton since my first.

Falling fall short of perfection is not wasted effort. Cheers.

I'm not sure about your location, but in the winter here, with the heat on, my leaf can dry out from the time I pull it out of the bag and bunch a few leaves into a stick. Not crinkly dry but not stretchy any more either, then it tears. It dries out quickly on me. If it was out for an hour at my house it would just crackle and break.

 

[DePasta]

Yep, it can dry fast...many, including me, run a small humidifier on the table to keep moisture in the surroundings. As far as rolling skills, early on, they will increase quickly...patience is key.

 

[Mathaious12]

The struggle is real keeping leaf in proper case.

 

[waikikigun]

I'd say if the rh is below 60, I can't keep a binder out for more than 2 minutes before it's too dry. I have to keep them in the casing bag just as I would have to with wrappers.

Contrary to what some good folks above say, I don't think binders and wrappers are or should be shipped in a proper rolling case. That would be too much moisture in the bag for too long: funky things may ensue. Better for it to be just flexible enough, or packed correctly such that, it does not get damaged in transport but also doesn't start doing weird fermentation things.

 

[ChinaVoodoo]

I moisten my wrapper leaves with a spray bottle. I only spray the underside because if you spray the tops, they can get discoloured. Also, I do it in stages: a few sprays, back in the bag, a couple hours later, a couple more sprays, then leave overnight. When I am actually wrapping, I wet a tea towel and put my already moistened wrapper leaves in it, right next to me. Easy access to take one out at a time.

Binder, I just spray them all just before wrapping, and leave them in a stack. If I'm going slow, I'll give them a spritz or two as i go. Same with the filler if its crumbly, but not as much as the binder.

 

[yo1dog]

I'm not sure about your location, but in the winter here, with the heat on, my leaf can dry out from the time I pull it out of the bag and bunch a few leaves into a stick.

Yep, it can dry fast...many, including me, run a small humidifier on the table to keep moisture in the surroundings.

The struggle is real keeping leaf in proper case.

I'd say if the rh is below 60, I can't keep a binder out for more than 2 minutes before it's too dry. I have to keep them in the casing bag just as I would have to with wrappers.

Wow. I'm surprised. I assumed since cigars don't dry out that fast whole leaves wouldn't either. Good to know!

Contrary to what some good folks above say, I don't think binders and wrappers are or should be shipped in a proper rolling case.

I believe this is the case. The wiki states leaves from WLT are "sealed within the bags at medium case".

 

[deluxestogie]

I assumed since cigars don't dry out that fast whole leaves wouldn't either.

It's about surface area to volume. An open leaf is nearly all surface area, and no volume. A rolled cigar is mostly volume, with a little surface area. The moisture content is by volume, whereas the evaporation rate (or the opposite, moisture absorption rate) is by surface area. The slowest cigar shape to dry is a (theoretical) sphere, which would have the absolute lowest surface area to volume. Thin cigars dry faster than fat cigars. Thinner leaf dries faster than thicker leaf.

Bob

 

[yo1dog]

Makes sense. Same as melting ice and why ice spheres are used in Whiskey.

I chuckled imaging attempting to smoke a spherical cigar.