When is the best time to harvest your plants?

[Jitterbugdude]

Traditionally, the Ag system as we know it is set up to benefit the farmer and big business, not the consumer. (OK, a caveat here.. its really all about big business because the farmer always gets ripped off) Consider that produce cultivars grown are not the best, juiciest most tasty, rather they are products that can be picked early, and shipped across the country with minimal damage. For example, blueberries, strawberries, peaches, broccoli to name a few. Any one that has ever picked a veggie or fruit right from their garden can attest to this.

So this brings us to tobacco. As a rough rule, tobacco is picked about 3 weeks after topping. But why 3 weeks? Does that benefit the guy that's going to smoke it or the farmer or big business?

Consider this: Burley was (maybe still is) harvested about 3 weeks after topping. If the farmer waits two more weeks he will increase his yield by about 400 more pounds per acre. The Burley farmer will then leave the stalks out in the sun for several days. This helps evaporate about 20% of the moisture away making hauling to the barn easier. Additionally, leaves are more easily sun burned at 3 weeks as opposed to 5 weeks. Cigar leaf was always stalk cured ( in the hey days of the 1880's) Now it is primed. Why? Well for one, primed leaves weigh more than stalk cured leaves. The farmer sells by weight not quantity, so the more weight the better. Then we have the discovery of flue curing. It speeds up the curing process from about 2 months to about a week.

My thinking here is this: Just because "that's the way you do it" doesn't mean it might be the best for the tobacco. With that in mind I have decided to stalk cure half of my 15 varieties at 1 week, 2 and 3 weeks time. At the same time I will also prime the remainder of the 15 varieties. This fall I will make ciggies and cigars to give out to about half a dozen of my friends. I'm hoping that the results will come back that there is no difference. Why? Because stalk curing is about one thousand times easier than priming.

A few years ago I primed some Havana 263 and Connecticut shade leaf the same day I topped the plants. I put these through the normal curing and fermenting process and I have to say they sucked!. They tasted like a bland piece of paper.

If any one has info on why industry harvests when they do I would love to know. I know things like nicotine continue to rise after topping and at some point the plant degrades. Any experiences with stalk curing and priming would also be of interested.

Now another caveat/observation. I've smoked some of BigBonner's Burley and it is excellent. Would it be better harvested at 2 weeks? I don't know

I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel here, just making it spin easier.

Randy B... hoping stalk curing is the way to go!

 

[deluxestogie]

I'll speak to cigar leaf production. When the entire stalk is harvested, the lowest leaves are overly ripe, if not deteriorated, and the tips (ligero) are tiny and immature.

I've found that the lowest intact leaves, if properly primed, make superb wrappers. They are smooth and mild, as well as large and thin. Their color tends to be fairly light and consistent.

The tips, when allowed to reach maturity, are of medium size, thick, intensely flavored and relatively high in nicotine. These tend to ferment to a rich maduro. With some milder varieties, such as Hickory Pryor, the fermented tips make a spectacular oscuro wrapper.

For the middle leaves on the plant, the issue of priming vs. whole-plant-harvesting I suspect comes down to the durations of the two stages of curing (yellowing; drying). Generally, yellowing should be long and slow, while drying as rapid as possible after the leaf has died.

The longer the second stage of the cure is protracted by a relatively high humidity the darker will the leaf be. Again, each time the tobacco comes into high case, after the cure is finished, the color will be further deepened. The rational method of procedure, therefore, is to maintain a high humidity during the first stage of the cure and then, as soon as the color has developed, to dry out the leaf comparatively rapidly. After the cure is finished, the tobacco should be prevented from coming into high case or order until it is to be taken down, so far as this is possible.

Having the leaf attached to the stalk during these two phases would seem to enhance the first stage, but retard the second. If aiming for light colored wrappers, then having the stalk attached would be less desirable. Since many of us use shed curing, subject to the variations of ambient temperature and humidity, this may rather be an issue of avoiding mold on the yellowed, dead leaf, which may be more of a problem if the stalk is present.

FmGrowit has commented elsewhere on the metabolic differences in the dying leaf when on vs. off the stalk. I have no experience with this.

My past production, priming all the leaf, has yielded 1/2 pound of cured leaf per plant. The physical condition of the leaf, each handled individually, was excellent, with very few tattered leaves. (Of course, mechanical plant harvesting will yield a higher percentage of tattered leaves, simply as a result of the process.)

My opinion is that priming tobacco for cigar leaf results in a higher quality leaf, a larger number of quality lower leaves, and a better quality of larger upper leaves.

For me, there is one other reason to prime the leaf. My curing shed does not have adequate height for hanging an entire plant. When I needed to do that for a late-season blowdown, I had to prime the upper leaves from the stalk just to hang it for wilting. And I don't enjoy hefting the substantial weight of a stalk full of tobacco any distance at all.

Bob

 

[FmGrowit]

I prefer to prime the leaves as theyripen. Stalk curing is fine when you don't have time to process yourleaf the best way that it can be processed. Some varieties are beststalk cured, but as a general rule...the best finished product ismade from primed leaf.

Another huge advantage to priming is the leaf isn't damaged anywhere near as bad as stalk curing.

 

[BigBonner]

Burley production

One reason for waiting three weeks is the Royal MH 30 or any sucker stuff .This is the residue time frame .Tobacco sprayed with these chemicals is required to stand for 21 days before harvest , Harvesting before 21 days will leave the chemical on the tobacco after harvesting .PM test my tobacco at randon for residue of any chemical . My samples have always come back with no chemical trace at all .I have seen farmers pick up the tobacco because it failed the chemical test .

I wait 4 + weeks to harvest most of the time .The tobacco will gain from 250 to 400 pounds per acre per week after topping . There is a point after the 4th week ,where tobacco no longer grows and no longer gains weight and will start loosing pounds . Leaves will start browning at the bottom and Suckers start growing at the top of the plant . The leaves on 4 to 5 week tobacco will be extremely brickle , this makes handeling mass produced burley difficult . Some leaves will rot off at the stalk and fall off on their own .

Tobacco harvested at two weeks is thinner with shorter leaves . Tobacco leaves will lengthen 2 to 6 inches and get wider after topping.

Stalk curing ? I hang my burley in the barns . After the leaves brown some with the mid rib still green I close up my barns to let the stalk and mid rib keep moisture in the barns to color cure the leaves .I hang the tobacco close togather to keep the leaves from drying too fast .

Tobacco that dry's too fast will have a bad color . It will often have green streeks or off colors in the leaf from yellow splotches to a light color .Tobacco cured with good amounts of moisture will turn darker and have a more even color .Too much moisture will cause house burn , this is basically rotten tobacco .

Last year for me it was too hot and dry to cure tobacco properly .It was a extreme drought and hot year for me . I hung my barns full of tobacco waited a few days then closed the doors and fly windows to keep what little moisture there was in the leaves , stems and stalks to help color cure my tobacco . I still had some green in my crop . The june and July sweat will take the green out .

If you cut open a marlboro you will see some green in them this is the green from burley that was not cured properly .

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Well, maybe about October or so I'll let you guys know how this turns out. I just came in from hanging a bunch of stalks and primings!

 

[BarG]

So how many plants you talking Jitterbugdude. Go figure

spacetime

would relate to tobacco. I primed all my plants simply out of wanting to get get the most leaf as possible,. I'm stalk curing the tops {3-7 leaves} because of hassle for handling smaller leaves{green immature}. I'm trying to determine best way to process smaller leaves and best use. Any suggestions

 

[Jitterbugdude]

I have about 125 plants from 15 different varieties. Of those about 35-40 are being stalk cured, the rest primed. I started priming at 2 weeks instead of the "normal" 3 weeks..

 

[deluxestogie]

I'm trying to determine best way to process smaller leaves and best use. Any suggestions

If you handle those small, upper leaves with the usual care lavished on the larger leaves, you will find that they are:

• higher in nicotine
• thicker
• more flavorful
• ferment to a much darker color
• are excellent for seasoning milder blends

They are referred to as "ligero" in the cigar lexicon, as "tips" in the burley lexicon, and are well worth the effort. As I prime my leaves, I attempt to allow the tips to reach the fullest maturity possible, prior to harvesting them.

Tips: top 4 or so leaves [about 1/8 of the leaves]
Leaf: upper half of the plant, minus the tips [about 3/8 of the leaves]
Lugs: lower half of the plant, minus the mud lugs [about 3/8 of the leaves]
Mud Lugs (or sand lugs, or "flyers and trash"): bottom 2 to 4 leaves [about 1/8 of the leaves]

With many varieties, the "lugs" ferment to a thin, mild gold; the "leaf" ferments to a thicker, more flavorful and stronger brown; the tips produce an intense, aromatic oscuro (nearly black).

When you stalk harvest, much of the growth of the tips has not yet occurred.

Bob

 

[BigBonner]

I have been topping some Conn Broadleaf and dark fire / air tobacco . I have a lot of leaves from the tops of these plants . Like two trash sacks full . The leaves are from 6" to 14" . Has anyone saved these leaves from either of these varietys and are they worth saving ?

In my past burley production We just toss all leaves that fall off during harvest and all leaves that we break out with the bud / blooms .

This is my first year raising Conn Broadleaf . I have now found out that after the first month of growing , You are supposed to break off the first four leaves from the bottom . This is something I didn't do .

 

[Jitterbugdude]

This is my first year raising Conn Broadleaf . I have now found out that after the first month of growing , You are supposed to break off the first four leaves from the bottom . This is something I didn't do .

There are two schools of thought on that. Some people break off the bottom leaves when they top, thinking it will allow the remaining leaves to grow bigger, others believe that leaving the bottom leaves on the stalk will allow more sun and nutrients to be absorbed.. making bigger leaves plus the lower leaves will act as a shield and prevent mud from getting on the next set of leaves.

 

[BigBonner]

The bottom four leaves are broken off in Conn valley by the farmers . A man I know who raises 30 acres there said his broker has him to break off the bottom four leaves .This supossedly make the rest of the leaves bigger and better . He said that the brokers won't buy the bottom leaves and when stripping the broadleaf they just throw those leaves on the floor anyway .

 

[Daniel]

So far my experience is with only 4 varieties only. Monte Calm Yellow, Yellow Twist Bud, Bursa and Virginia Bright Leaf. Priming has resulted in various results. MCY and YTB are easy to cure even when leaves are considerably green colored when picked. VBL does not yellow like the other two on the stalk as much and so far remains much greener when hung in the shop. I am thinking I should stalk harvest it and did a couple of plants yesterday as a test. From what I have foudn about Bursa it also needs to be stalk harvested. many of the lower leaves have not only yellowed but have dried right on the stalk so we removed those but basically are waiting for about 2 thirds of the plant to start yellowing and then will cut down the entire plant to hang.

This being my first year at growing I am making decisions based upon reading lots of information and then the results I get. I know we are making some mistakes but so far nothing catastrophic.

 

[Chicken]

i didnt prime none of mine,, i hung them up green,,, and let them colour cure,,,,

is priming that important,?

this weekend i plan on harvesting all my shariza,,,, it's been about 4-6 weeks since i topped them,,, but im gonna let the sucker leaves continue to grow,,,

perhaps i'll prime some of this bunch and see what happens,,,

 

[FmGrowit]

Best I can tell about priming is it freezes the growth of the leaf at the exact time you pick it. Stalk cured leaf keeps growing for a while.

 

[Chicken]

my baccy has turned out perfect,,,,

i may continue to do it without priming,,, since thier is no issues with my non-priming,,,,

my 2 strains didnt yellow on the plant ,, like ive read that a ripe leaf is suppose to do,,,,

they yellowed a little,, all ive picked so far had some yellowing going on,,,,but turning all the way yellow,,, it did not,